cann
Hot Rod
"For you Hardcastle, anytime"
Posts: 68
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Post by cann on Sept 19, 2006 12:26:14 GMT -5
I have only been reading fanfiction for a year or so now, but the writers on H&M are the best, maybe because the show was one of my favorites. But I am not real sure what a zine is? If it is fanfiction in a writen form I might be interested. How do you find zines and how much do they usually cost? I would appreciate someone explaining it to me. Thank you!
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Post by lmlewis on Sept 19, 2006 14:38:21 GMT -5
In the days before the internet, when we dinosaurs roamed the earth, and wriiting was done with typewriters, at best, and copying involved mimeograph machines, and the like, brave souls wrote fics and sent them out into the the unknown, and probably never even knew how many people were reading them. No hit counters, no instant feedback. Yup, those were the days, laboring in the scriptorium by lamplight. There are some 'zines still in print (and very spiffy, I might add)--Nanci, and Mysti (Agents With Style) have them, and old zines pop up from time to time on E-Bay. STAR for BK has a 'zine on CD' as a fund raiser--all new stories written this year. Liz has an archive of titles of nearly everything that was ever written, and where they were published (it's in the files at Michelle's board tv.groups.yahoo.com/group/GullsWay/ ), but, as you can see from her earlier note, much has been lost. Also, as I've said previously, Michelle's fic site has a few more stories than ffnet. The past one and a half years has seen the addition of over 160 stories to the ffnet collection, more than half of them before the first season came out on DVD. Fanfic is usually a reactive phenomenon--stories appear when the show or movie is hot. H&McC is almost unique: no commercial release was in sight, it wasn't appearing in rerun (at least not in the States) and still there was this persistant, dogged following, some of them (like Liz) with credentials that go back to the beginning.
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cann
Hot Rod
"For you Hardcastle, anytime"
Posts: 68
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Post by cann on Sept 19, 2006 17:10:58 GMT -5
I know I probably seem like a complete idiot, but does the Yahoo group cost to join?
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Post by lmlewis on Sept 19, 2006 18:58:23 GMT -5
I know I probably seem like a complete idiot, but does the Yahoo group cost to join? Just like this one, absolutely free. I like 'em both. They have files over there; this one has all the bells and whistles capabilities for notewriting itself, which I really like. They put all the notes up in order of being submitted, this one sorts 'em by topic. Quite different on many counts, but both good. And I like all the screen caps here, right in the notes themselves for easy viewing and discussion. Oh, and nice people on both boards--many the same but some unique to each.
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cann
Hot Rod
"For you Hardcastle, anytime"
Posts: 68
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Post by cann on Sept 19, 2006 19:43:07 GMT -5
thank you, you are right...the people here seem really really nice.
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ajk
Grease Monkey
Posts: 23
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Post by ajk on Sept 21, 2006 8:19:52 GMT -5
In the days before the internet, when we dinosaurs roamed the earth, and wriiting was done with typewriters, at best, and copying involved mimeograph machines, and the like, brave souls wrote fics and sent them out into the the unknown, and probably never even knew how many people were reading them. No hit counters, no instant feedback. Yup, those were the days, laboring in the scriptorium by lamplight. Ah yes, the good old days. Still say there's nothing like getting the written word in your hand and having a good old read. Still print the stories I want to read off the net, can't sit at a computer and read, I find I can't get so involved - that's probably just me though.
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Post by lmlewis on Sept 21, 2006 19:13:57 GMT -5
In the days before the internet, when we dinosaurs roamed the earth, and wriiting was done with typewriters, at best, and copying involved mimeograph machines, and the like, brave souls wrote fics and sent them out into the the unknown, and probably never even knew how many people were reading them. No hit counters, no instant feedback. Yup, those were the days, laboring in the scriptorium by lamplight. Ah yes, the good old days. Still say there's nothing like getting the written word in your hand and having a good old read. Still print the stories I want to read off the net, can't sit at a computer and read, I find I can't get so involved - that's probably just me though. Well, I like curling up with a good book, and there's less eye-strain with a non-electronic printed surface, and I know lots of people who mostly always print-and-read, but when it comes to production, give me the e-world every time. It was hellish cold and lonely in the scriptorium, and the fumes from the white-out were nasty, and, for heavens sake, you had to know how to spell. Nowadays when I finish something, even at three in the morning (which is most often when I finish), I know I have at least one member of the support team who is both as insomniac as I am, and lives two time zones west, as well. I've got a couple of betas who are both absolutely supportive, and will whack me upside the head if I screw up. The weirdest thing was actually writing a novel with two people who I'd never met face-to-face. (Come to think of it, maybe it works better that way ;-)) On the other hand, proboard spellcheck doesn't like 'scriptorium', and that's a real word, for Pete's sake.
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Post by cheride on Sept 23, 2006 19:04:07 GMT -5
Ah yes, the good old days. Still say there's nothing like getting the written word in your hand and having a good old read. Still print the stories I want to read off the net, can't sit at a computer and read, I find I can't get so involved - that's probably just me though. Well, I like curling up with a good book, and there's less eye-strain with a non-electronic printed surface, and I know lots of people who mostly always print-and-read, but when it comes to production, give me the e-world every time. It was hellish cold and lonely in the scriptorium, and the fumes from the white-out were nasty, and, for heavens sake, you had to know how to spell. Nowadays when I finish something, even at three in the morning (which is most often when I finish), I know I have at least one member of the support team who is both as insomniac as I am, and lives two time zones west, as well. I've got a couple of betas who are both absolutely supportive, and will whack me upside the head if I screw up. The weirdest thing was actually writing a novel with two people who I'd never met face-to-face. (Come to think of it, maybe it works better that way ;-)) On the other hand, proboard spellcheck doesn't like 'scriptorium', and that's a real word, for Pete's sake. Yes, I have to agree that the production side of things has gotten far simpler in the virtual reality. A brand new world of opportunity of shared insight and perception have become available, and it's great. And, personally, while I don't always understand your insomniac energy, I have often been grateful for it. And as for writing without meeting, well, it occurs to me that as disjointed as emails and IMs often become, there might exist true chaos if there was a shared location and perhaps sugar and caffeine involved. ;D
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Post by lmlewis on Sept 23, 2006 19:19:56 GMT -5
Yes, I have to agree that the production side of things has gotten far simpler in the virtual reality. A brand new world of opportunity of shared insight and perception have become available, and it's great. And, personally, while I don't always understand your insomniac energy, I have often been grateful for it. And as for writing without meeting, well, it occurs to me that as disjointed as emails and IMs often become, there might exist true chaos if there was a shared location and perhaps sugar and caffeine involved. ;D IMHO sugar just blunts the effects of the caffeine--kinda like mixing real food with your lembas bread. ;-)
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Liz
Speed Demon
Such special moments...
Posts: 150
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Post by Liz on Sept 26, 2006 17:41:47 GMT -5
Ah yes, the good old days. Still say there's nothing like getting the written word in your hand and having a good old read. Still print the stories I want to read off the net, can't sit at a computer and read, I find I can't get so involved - that's probably just me though. That was something that took me a long time to get used to, reading off the computer. I still appreciate the written word, but I now do quite a bit off the web. But there was nothing like getting the fanzine in the mail and smelling the unique odor of mimeograph (remember those?) or being able to stroke the beautiful artwork (something that is sadly lacking on the internet) that accompanied a story.
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Liz
Speed Demon
Such special moments...
Posts: 150
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Post by Liz on Sept 26, 2006 18:00:00 GMT -5
Funny, Amy and I were talking about this on Sunday when she was driving me to Gull's-Way, the pro and con of the modern age. I think that the younger writers who post directly to the internet are lacking an advantage we who came up the hard way had...an editor. Although there are betas out there, I don't think many of the younger writers use them. The instant gratification of posting to the net loses the learning experience of having someone mark up your precious story.
Melinda Reynolds wasn't my first zine editor, but was my first in this fandom and, I believe, possibly the toughest I've ever had. And yet, I probably learned more about writing from her than I could possibly explain. I learned how to rework scenes, how to find the right word, how to lay off the words "and" and "but" (something I still have a bit of a problem with), and how to stand my ground when I truly believed in a scene or passage or word.
New writers need someone who will tell them the truth, teach them to use spellcheck, but understand that it isn't always right. They need to research! Everywhere I've been and everything I've done tends to be reworked into my stories. And if I don't know something, I look it up, either in a book or on the internet.
This isn't to discourage them. We need more writers and, I have to say, this fandom appears to have some of the best new and old writers, but if you look at others (NCIS, NUMB3RS, CRIMINAL MINDS, etc.), you'll see the dross and find it hard to find the gold.
To my mind, a story should have a purpose...to make you cry, to make you laugh, to make you think, to fill in a missing scene, to explain an action or lack of action, to go into the mind of the character. I don't consider Mary Sues to have a purpose other than to write yourself into a story and win the hero. That, I admit, is a purpose, but one that only interests the writer. That is a story that shouldn't be shared. It should be written and quietly put away to be reread after ten more stories have been written.
I admit that I never really went the Mary Sue route myself, don't know why, it just didn't happen for me, so I may be a little harsher than if I had done it myself. When I wrote, I was the hero, whether it was Artemus Gordon or Goniff or Montgomery Scott or Tully Pettingrew or Illya Kuryakin or any of the many others that I dabbled with. I certainly didn't want some girl mucking up the friendships of my favorite characters.
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Post by pheral on Sept 27, 2006 3:39:32 GMT -5
Although there are betas out there, I don't think many of the younger writers use them. Yup, and to compound this, alot of the betas out there aren't well enough qualified! (and when i say qualified, i don't mean actual qualifications of course, i just mean they're sometimes just not experienced enough writers to be advising others, even on punctuation) I think though, it depends what fandom and what area online you pop up in. I was lucky enough, the first time i went online, to fall into a fantastic Stargate Yahoo community, full of amazing writers i could aspire to, and who were happy to check my work and make me aware of the importance of a beta. And i agree the printed word has more charm... it took me ages to convert to typing my stories straight onto a keyboard, i used to have to write by pen and type them up afterwards for ages, because my thoughts just kept wanting to go down my right arm into a biro! I'm certainly real glad H&Mc has a spattering of really excellent writers.
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ajk
Grease Monkey
Posts: 23
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Post by ajk on Sept 29, 2006 5:13:25 GMT -5
Although there are betas out there, I don't think many of the younger writers use them. The instant gratification of posting to the net loses the learning experience of having someone mark up your precious story. New writers need someone who will tell them the truth, teach them to use spellcheck, but understand that it isn't always right. They need to research! Everywhere I've been and everything I've done tends to be reworked into my stories. And if I don't know something, I look it up, either in a book or on the internet. I agree about the Beta, you always need an independant person to read through stories for you, most of the time you're to close to it to be objective. I always use my sister as a beta - I trust her judgement and she tells me truthfully if the story not worth it, but always in a constructive way. Research! Yes, call me sick but I love research! I have to say one of the things that puts me off a story quicker than anything else is lack of research - particularly if its a story thats not set in the present day (or the future for that matter) - I was recently put off two stories because the authors didn't research their periods - one was set in the early 70's and apparently everyone was using microwave ovens back then! Even worse for me a story set in 1962 when someone was invoved in a pile up despite them having'Sat Nav' (satellite navigation) in their car!!
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Liz
Speed Demon
Such special moments...
Posts: 150
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Post by Liz on Sept 29, 2006 9:43:59 GMT -5
I was recently put off two stories because the authors didn't research their periods - one was set in the early 70's and apparently everyone was using microwave ovens back then! I still remember our first microwave, included with our house in Miami, bought in 1972. Actually, it was more a convection oven, remember them? The steak was so grey when we used it that after that all it did was defrost. We moved from there in 1975 and didn't get our next microwave until 1980-82. Very large and lasted for 26 years. Sorry, got a little off topic here. But I agree, if you don't remember the 70s/80s, ask someone who lived then or do some reading from that time period.
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Post by owlcroft on Sept 30, 2006 2:47:57 GMT -5
Ooh, you want to know something kind of funny and kind of sad? I knew someone who had a microwave in 1986 and wouldn't stand within 5 feet of it when it was in operation because she was afraid of the radiation. True story!
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